BBO Show with Kyle & Harms


How to create an online business using your EXPERT skill set


What you’ll learn in today’s show

BBO.SHOW #10 – How to create an online business using your EXPERT skill set

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What you will learn in today’s show:

  • Create an onlines business by leveraging your expert skill
  • What is an infopreneur
  • How to create a passive income online
  • Understand an online info businesses value ladder
  • Plus much more

The focus area is: expert business.

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Read the transcript instead…


BBO.SHOW #10: How to create an online business using your EXPERT skill set


Harms: We are very much focusing on a completely new subject. 

Kyle: This week we want to talk about how you as a professional, as somebody who has skills as an expert in your particular field, how you can package up that knowledge and build an online business based on your expertise based on your skills and your knowledge.

Harms: If somebody says what do you mean by expert?

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Kyle: Even if you don’t think of yourself as an expert, even if you don’t think of yourself as world class, top of your particular field in whatever you do, you are to some people an expert. 

People who don’t necessarily know as much as you. You have skills and you have knowledge, which can be monetised online. 

Some people whenever we talk about this topic with them they say they don’t have any skills. I can’t do anything. 

Generally this is not the case. 

Maybe you’ve just finished your GCSEs and you really don’t have any real-life experience, even then, you can tutor people in the GCSE’s you have a skill, you have an expertise you can fall back on.

But generally most people don’t think they’re experts because of psychological blocks. 

They aren’t comfortable calling themselves an expert. 

They’re not comfortable with what they can do. A lot of what we’re going to be talking about today is unlocking what your expertise is and how you would turn that into a product, you do not need to be the world leader. 

You do not need to have a Nobel Prize in your field. In fact if you’re at that kind of level it’s often debilitating. 

Those people aren’t very good at packaging up what they know, they’re so detached from amateurs in their field that they don’t know what other people don’t know. 

They take it for granted that other people know as much about their field as they do.

If you are at the top of your field. Good for you, you’re probably not the person we’re going to be talking to. 

We’re talking about the people who have expertise, they have knowledge, they have skills in which they can pass on to other people.

Harms: Because the common misconception is very simple, I am not good enough to be selling my expertise or skills. Or I’ve not been in this industry for a period of time. 

Some people associate it with how long you’ve been in an industry with whether you are not an expert. Some people will add the barrier that I’m not old enough to teach this particular expertise. 

As you go through this try not to put up barriers just try to keep an open mind with what we’re saying, and then just apply what relevant items are for yourself and that’s the key.

We will discuss something that is not going to apply to everybody. We’ve spoken about event businesses, yoga trainer’s, personal trainers, coaches, mentors who physically meet people on a one-to-one basis. 

We’ve spoken about making money online using the big list, but that also only applied to specific people in different categories. 

Who it isn’t for?

Harms: Okay Kyle, who isn’t this for?

Kyle: The most obvious one here is for the people who say they don’t have skills, they’re not an expert, I’m no good at anything. 

I’m pushing back on that saying you are. 

Like the GCSE example, maybe you didn’t get the best grades in your GCSE you’re 15, 16, you’ve just finished and you got A’s. You did well, but you’re not top of the country or anything like that, but you are also head of the basketball team, and maybe you run the school newspaper. 

You are an expert in getting good grades while maintaining a high level of sports and community interaction. You are an expert in that particular combination so you don’t need to be the expert in biology, you need to be the expert in okay, I’m really good at biology, but I also run this club. I am sporty and I set up an online business. 

It’s in the intersections between different professions, between different skills. 

That’s where we can find your expertise, you’re an expert at being you and you’re the only person who is you and you are the one who is an expert at that.

There’s going to be some value there for some people out there which you can monetise. 

If you’re thinking I don’t have any skills, I’m not an expert on anything. Nonsense. 

The only people this isn’t for are for people who know they are an expert or they found out what they’re an expert at, but they are unwilling to teach other people. 

People who have an expertise and are like “this is mine and I’m never going to give away this knowledge, this is a trade secret”. This is how I make my money; this is what makes me who I am. I’m never going to tell you what it is.

Those people who aren’t willing to teach, those people who aren’t willing to share, then they are the people who this expert funnel is not for. 

If you see the world as a zero-sum world where if I do well you do badly, then this is not going to work for you. 

We’re only interested in talking to people who have an expertise, who have skills and knowledge and they want to share it with other people. 

Understanding that helps everybody, that helps them and it helps the world and if you’re not really on board with that, I would say this guide is not going to click with you.

Harms: That’s okay if that’s your viewpoint, or that’s your model in terms of how you run your particular business or within your expertise, or you may already have an inner circle that you share this stuff with. 

But you don’t really want to share this with the wider world. 

What I would say is also this applies to people who this may not be exactly for you and Kyle may disagree here, but it’s very much so, does this kind of wealth generation or the way you make money also suit your personality? 

Does it suit your style in the way in which you can best make cash?

For example Kyle and I many years ago did a personality test just to work out where we are best suited in terms of generating cash. 

Where does our happiness also come from? 

Teaching, sharing our knowledge, sharing things, our experiences, case studies. Even if a client pays us thousands and thousands of pounds there will be parts of that which are not very specific to this particular business that we can now share with a wider audience, so that the larger pool benefits. 

It is a case of actually we enjoy doing this, we are teachers by nature so often people who teach this kind of subject get a bad rep because the thing that comes back at them is, well why are you teaching this? 

Surely you can make loads of money from this, why are you not keeping it a secret? 

That goes back to what Kyle says if you are a hoarder of trade secrets and your happiness comes from just making loads of cash in silence, then that is a type of personality.

That’s fine, but Kyle and I get our happiness and what works for us is through teaching the mechanism of educating groups and the online world is really very much the best place to do that.

If somebody is here and they haven’t built an online business yet, but you are wanting instant cash from your expertise, then this also might not be for you. 

If you remember the principle is very simple, an online business is still a business and we’re going to work you through the process of building that online business around your expert skill. 

But if you’re thinking I’m going to make instant cash straight after today this might not be for you. 

We’re focusing on building an online business around your expert niche. 

If it doesn’t work for you that’s okay. Again, other sections will apply better. 

Intro to the niche / Why we’re doing this niche

Kyle:  Depending on your disposition, depending on your skills and what you enjoy doing there are going to be different business structures, different ways of adding value for different people. 

If you don’t want to be a well-known expert, package up your expertise and knowledge, that’s fine. 

We’re not going to sell everything as the way to make money online.

Harms: Why in particular this niche and also there is a scenario going on right now if you aren’t aware, it’s called covid-19, coronavirus. People are on lockdown and if you’ve not been living without the Internet you cannot escape it. 

But essentially, we are in a strange time right now and Kyle chooses the topics, so what made you think of doing this because it’s quite timely as well.

Kyle: Quite specifically I have a friend who is a really high-end visual effects, he does graphic work for film and TV really. He’s furloughed. He’s being paid to sit at home and do nothing. And this is a highly skilled individual whose skills are being wasted.

There’s a lot of talent in the world. I think globally now this is just one example, but there’s a lot of talent that is not being used. 

People are either unemployed or underemployed, it’s wasted talent. 

What I’m suggesting and I think this is a good business model anyway. But right now it really makes sense to take all of that knowledge, take that expertise and start to package it up into products. 

We’re going to get it out into the world. 

There’s a lot of learners out there at the moment as well because people are sitting at home like, what shall I do, and we will make a bit of money while doing it. 

We are going to create a business based on your expertise based on creating a product from your knowledge.

Harms: If you are in the fortunate position where you now have time but your income is okay then great, what we’re saying is at the start of this guide we’re going to be leveraging the idea that we do have time in order to create a product that can generate us an income, even when we go and carry on with our normal day job. 

This can be a supplementary income, it can be a bonus income, it can drip feed small amounts income to you as time goes by. 

We are not saying just sacking the boss or leaving the work job tomorrow, we’re saying now we’ve got some time let’s leverage it and start to create something using everything we know in the background.

This kind of business is categorised as a buzzword which jumped out in the last, I feel five, six years is an info entrepreneur.

Kyle: I think it’s Tai Lopez who popularised this. It’s the idea of the most perfect product you can produce online is information. Unlike selling a chair or an oven, information is very easy to sell. You can deliver it easily. 

Infopreneur is based on this marketing of information because information is the most pure form of digital content. 

It is the most pure form of online business that you can set up and as such it has been thrown around as like the thing that you should be doing. Infopreneur or information entrepreneur has become this buzzword around this, it doesn’t devalue the fact that selling information and selling knowledge is still a very valuable thing to do. 

It’s just often been packaged up into these get rich quick courses where you are selling information that either you didn’t necessarily make, or you haven’t added much value to it. 

You might be selling the same information as a thousand other people and then based on business principles you’re not going to make any money from that.

What we’re talking about is you as the expert will produce something of value and put that out into the world. 

That’s going to be the main difference between what we talk about and the get rich quick version of information marketing. 

You are genuinely going to have to create something valuable first.

Harms: This is not you’re going to create a product and it’s going to make somebody a multi-millionaire overnight.

Kyle: That is going to be based on the value of the information you’re producing. 

You’re going to be creating something valuable, so that’s why we said there’s going to be work involved. 

You are going to have to actually create something.

Harms: The other common thing is I have to be selling an information product or package which involves somebody else making money. Now that’s a big misconception because actually no. 

What if your information product teaches somebody how to do digital graphic work or digital art on an iPad? 

What if you teach somebody how to create this image and be able to put it onto a cover which can then be put onto an iPad cover as an example? 

What if it taught people how to become editors? 

Ultimately, a lot of things end up with somebody benefiting financially depending on if it’s a job, freelance gig, or a particular kind of business, but it doesn’t have to be. 

It can also be teaching people how to speak Chinese; that’s something Kyle has done in the past and continues to do.

The result could be they have a financial gain but also it could be that they learn something new. They get to explore a new idea that they’ve always wanted to try. 

I did a calligraphy class live with the lady who does calligraphy for the Royal family so it was a cool experience, but that was more of I want to learn this item as we’re quite curious about it and that was live. 

What if that were packaged as a digital item, it would have the same benefit for me. 

Think outside the box, think about not only what expertise can you share with somebody to make their money that is not always the case here. 

There is plenty of information out there which is packaged up to just teach somebody something.

Kyle: For example Russell Brunson is one of these info entrepreneurs. 

He runs a software company called clickfunnels, but his first information product and his information business was teaching people how to make a spud cannon. Which is basically a way to blast potatoes using a big long piece of tubing hundreds of feet, so he went out with his brother and they shot videos about how to use the spud cannon. 

There are videos and some PDF plans of how you put the spud cannon together and what type of PVC piping to get from home dep, that kind of stuff. That was his first product. 

Is that making people money? 

Is that helping people professionally? 


But he packaged up information that he had, that he learnt and he made a business out of that. Again it doesn’t have to be professional. 

It doesn’t have to be money-related just a lot of courses out there are about making money, it doesn’t mean yours has to be.

But why is this a great business? 

What are the advantages of creating a business like this?

Information businesses as we just mentioned are the most pure digital online business and because of this there are some massive advantages.

By pure we mean there are no atoms involved, there are no physical goods. 

For example, my first big business was helping people learn to read and write Chinese. The first product I had were these posters, they were huge, they were a zero. It was a metre and a half long and I think it weighed like 4 kg and I had them printed in China, they were being sent mainly to America, Canada, and Europe. 

So my first product was this very heavy long cumbersome thing that I had to ship around the world. I made very little to no money because I would sell it for $20 and would cost me $20 to send it to Canada.

I then pivoted into digital goods so I would basically send the PDF of this a zero poster and instructions about how they can get it printed for five dollars at a nearby printshop. 

I sold that for nearly the same price, but I wasn’t spending all that money getting it shipped or anything like that because it was a purely digital good. It was a PDF I sent to them and profits just went through the roof because of that. 

Digital goods have no costs to manufacture, no cost to distribute, you don’t have your goods sitting in a warehouse accumulating dust, costing money.

So once you create it for the first time there is no marginal cost to sell it and it doesn’t cost you any more to sell a thousand units than it does to sell one.

Harms: Because in a conventional business every time you sell another unit comes with that marginal cost whether it’s labour costs, shipping, logistics, inventory, rental. 

If you sell a thousand items, you may have to upgrade your storage centre, even if you’re storing it somewhere else you may have to pay them a higher rent because they’re using more storage. It comes with additional costs, whereas digital goods do not.

Number two is you get a higher profit margin. 

If you take the poster example the profit margin essentially is everything that’s left after all of these costs are being put into place. The cost of his time. The cost of the printing, the cost of the packaging. 

In Kyle’s example, the profit margin may have been one to 2% left over after all is said and done, as an example, he said he made no money; it could be 0%. If the calculations are wrong here you could also end up on every product sold actually having a loss.

If you take the profit margin of a digital product once it is created the first time and some analytical people may say, let me factor the cost in my pounds per hour against the product, but more products you sell the profit margin increases to the point where, whatever the price is less any e-commerce shop subscription items and you can really simplify this. That is what is left. 

So high profit margins are number two.

Kyle: Once you’ve got it all set up, it becomes automatic. I don’t want to use the word passive income but we are going to have to touch on it. 

When you do most work when you have a job the value you’re creating and how much you get paid is always tied to how many hours you work. 

That’s why we have terms like hourly wage, how much you get paid per hour and even the annual salary I get £50,000 a year, or whatever it is. 

These are tied to time and this is a very industrial revolution kind of way of thinking about how we get paid and this is just how we talk about salary. 

We don’t talk about abstract numbers; we talk about per hour or per year.

The only way to earn more money generally is to get a raise or just work more hours in the day, but there is only a limit to how many hours we work per day or per week or per month, which means it’s impossible for us to get 10 X or 100 X how much we are getting paid. 

If it’s tied to our time because we just do not have a thousand more hours to work. 

Instead, we need to be smart. 

We need to set up business systems that work independent of us, so things that keep selling even though we’re not there, so we can continue to generate income that is not tied to our hourly rate.

Harms: I would recommend anybody read the book, which is Robert Kiyosaki’s Rich dad poor dad cashflow quadrant, which is the second in the series. 

Where Kyle spoke about trading time for money we’re now dealing in the employed sector and the self-employed sector and they have their pros and cons. 

The idea is if there is going to be a want to go from employed or self-employed. There’s going to be a desire to do that. 

Self-employed yes, you get paid potentially more than employed, you have more control, you have more time freedom. 

There’s lots of benefits to that, and it often means you can pick and choose.

If you nail this you can pick and choose who your clients are, what kind of work you like to do. 

Over time you can build a brand with this as well, so it does work, but it still requires you in the general part to trade time for money. 

What we want to do is get to this side of the quadrant where we no longer have to trade time for money. 

Instead, what we’re doing is building a system, building assets. In this case, it’s a digital asset or an online business as the asset which will then pay us, regardless of what time of the say it is. We no longer have to trade time for money. 

We are trading our energy to create this in advance which will then continue to pay us ongoing and that’s where the philosophy of passive income comes from. We’re focusing on the business part.

What Robert Kiyosaki has evolved over the time is because when this was written, the online business world wasn’t it. It wasn’t out there. 

People weren’t necessarily generating revenue online as a passive income, it was very much property, real estate, stocks and shares, trading was the mechanism. Now online business very much falls into this category in a big way. 

Now investing is the final part; it’s not part of this discussion. 

But essentially somebody like myself and Kyle had a passive income you could purchase a percentage of that to now create income, which is where your money works hard for you.

Kyle:  Using your money to make money rather than your assets to make money.

Harms: Let us put this into context five years ago, Kyle created a digital product which he is still getting paid for today. 

Let’s not worry about the amount, frequency but five years ago he created a digital product which he is still making money for. 

That’s the part which should sink in here.

Kyle: I created a handful of PDFs and some videos, put them on a website and then this morning I woke up and there was £30, that’s impressive. 

That’s just one product, you can have multiple products, you can have multiple online businesses all ticking away and bringing money in, or a lot more money over time. 

That’s when you do reach this passive idea. 

The problem I personally have with the idea of passive income is it makes it sound like you’re getting money for nothing and you don’t do any work. 

That’s not true. 

You need to do work upfront, you need to create something of value that people want in the world and then after that point, yes, people continue to pay for that.

What SORT of business, business model

Harms: If you asked what is the work that’s required, I would say a nice model that I like to use is and the first thing to write down if you have a piece of paper is this, essentially there’s a triangle and three levels to the triangle. 

Level one is getting some knowledge, foundational level knowledge and that’s at the bottom, the base. If you’re looking at an expert online business becomes your foundational knowledge. 

Once you know and you are comfortable and you say actually this is exactly what I’d like to do, now you start to specialise. 

Specialising will be now getting to know all of the finer details on how I exactly implement this. 

The final bit is anybody who has got a successful business will know you need a coach, mentor, somebody to support you through that process or somebody who has been there.

You can get lots of foundational knowledge and you can do that every single week on the BBO show a new piece of foundational knowledge. 

Then when you’re ready, you can jump in and specialise.

What sort of business model because yes we’re talking about a macro business model. 

Now there can be a business model within that which is going to be based on your expertise. But how can people do something just as a thought exercise to start going and processing this? 

What’s a good way for them to start to understand what should be their business model within this category?

Where are you now? What areas of life have you been successful in? 

Kyle: This comes back to the question of what your expertise is? 

What have you mastered? 

What kind of information can you impart to other people? 

What we’re going to do with the business model is we are going to help people get to where you are right now, and if you start with that in mind, that makes it a lot easier. 

I like to think of this as let’s say you are you, you know what you know and you do what you do and a recent graduate from college or university has come to you and said, I really respect what you do, I want to get into your field, what do I do?

Imagine you’re meeting that person for coffee and you have an hour to chat to them and that’s a conversation that a lot of you can have. 

If you mentor or coach, or even if you give advice in any way you’ve probably done this already. All we’re going to be doing is taking that basic conversation that hour spent with the recent graduate over coffee, giving them a bit of advice we’re going to take that and package it up. 

We’re going to turn that into a product for anybody out there who is interested in learning what it is you know. Anybody who wants to get to where you are and have success in whatever area you have expertise in.

I think that’s the easiest way to think about the basis of this business model is, we’re going to be answering questions, we’re going to be helping people solve problems and help them get to where you are now. 

Think of it that way and we’re going to make a business of that.

What does this mean for “products”?

Harms: The next question that comes into play is I have had that discussion; I know what my expertise is. I’ve nailed it. 

If we now assume that somebody knows what their expertise is, they know what they would like to share with the world and create an online business for, what does that look like as a product? It’s not quite a service yet.

We’ll get to service later, because if you go back to the advantages of this, we want it to be digital. We want high profit margins. We want the low cost of inventory holding all those advantages that come with this. 

We want that in place, so we’re starting with a digital product.

Kyle: The main thing here is you need to be delivering information, you need to be teaching, you need to be showing people how to get to where you are. 

So we’re educating. 

There are different formats we can use for this. As mentioned before, it could be an e-book, checklist, a video course.

There is a very classic digital information product ladder, so you start with very easy to consume, free or low-cost information. 

Generally for this you’d use a blog, you might be posting on social media. Nowadays, it might be a podcast, so it’s free, it’s a way to get people interested, you’re starting to give away information and it’s easily consumable. 

Not yet the basis of the business, but it’s a way to get your message out to the world and start getting noticed, that’s the first part.

After that you want some form of product which allows you to encapsulate all of that free information you’ve been putting out in the world but make it more consumable and more actionable for the people who want to learn from you. 

Generally, the first step would be an e-book, but I’m talking about a short e-book not a 300-page book. I’m talking about a 50-page guide, or a package of resources and a checklist. 

Something just to get people moving, again this will be low cost. 

This is when we’re talking about $10, $15 but you can sell it to a large number of people, it’s an encapsulation of all the free stuff you’ve been putting out there, but in a much more concentrated form for people who just want to get on with it. They want to take action.

A short e-book would be the traditional way to do it, but it could also be a short course, I’m talking about a one- or two-hours video course which you record once and then you get it hosted on a website. 

You charge $20, $30 for. 

That’s another way to do it. 

First we had free stuff then we had a low-cost item. Then we’re going to have our core full paid offers. 

This could be a full course that might be seven, eight, 10 hours more video course, there will be a book. This one is a proper book. This might be a couple hundred pages. 

These will be the two core ones, but then you might want to start sprinkling in services at this point.

It might be things like consultation and mentoring, speaking at events etcetera. The basis on services is because they are reliant on your time and access that means that you have to charge more for them. 

Whereas a lot of experts would start with consultation and mentoring we’re putting them at the back end of our value ladder and charging a lot more for them. 

Because we have low-cost digital products beforehand. Then you might have premium offers so people have had the core offer which might be the video course or the book, then you have premium offers like mastermind which would be a small group of people all with the same goal. 

They are brought together and maybe you jump into that group; you help them with their goals. 

You might have things like retreats where you take the people who want to learn from you and you go on a physical retreat somewhere. 

This is tied to your time and so these are very high costs and then you have things like membership sites where people are paying a monthly subscription, and for that they get some kind of access to you. 

They get some kind of exclusive content and these are all premium offers.

Harms: Let’s assume now this is the scale and this is also the scale of the work. On the left is easily consumable and requires less work from you in regards to time, that’s the process here. In terms of revenue that you’re going to get from that, that will also be low revenue, it could be free to very little. 

On the other extreme, it means that it’s more difficult for the person to consume i.e. you’re probably going to have less customers in this area here and it does require more work from yourself, but the income goes through the roof in compared to this side of the value ladder, or this classic model in terms of presenting your information and packaging your information up.

This process also helps guide people to put it into action. 

Now those who want to interact with you, get access to you and benefit from your premium products that is the final step here. 

Now it’s going to be more people here and less people here. 

Typically that’s the way this works. For example, if we take Kyle’s digital poster if at some point somebody wants one-on-one time with Kyle to learn Chinese within that specific business that would be over here, but the short actionable guide that they purchased from him was his digital poster.

Kyle: The free and easily consumable is the A4 poster that you can download and it has the Chinese radicals on, it’s like the Chinese alphabet. 

That’s not true, but it’s similar enough. Free. You had to give me your email address and you got this PDF great. 

The short actionable guide was a video series I created about an hour and a half long, it’s called first week in Chinese and it’s basically saying you’re learning Chinese, these are the things you should be covering in the first week to get a grasp of how the methodology of how to learn Chinese. 

That was a couple of hours and I think it was $17, and that’s the short actionable guide. 

The full information product is the sensible Chinese character course it is $97. That’s about seven or eight hours of video and teaching you the methodology for learning Chinese characters.

For that particular business I did not stack any premiums offers on. But as Harminder says, it would have been consultation, mentoring, the mastermind some kind of membership program. 

Maybe getting people into a room teaching them these techniques, etcetera. Much higher costs and lower numbers and that business falls into this category here and it’s extremely powerful. 

That’s the focus. 

Let’s say you are our favourite niche yoga teachers.

The first free and easily consumable might be a set of YouTube videos you have, so totally free, people can check out what you do. 

The basics on YouTube are great. 

That’s what yoga with Adrienne does and she has built a multimillion-dollar company based on first giving away free information that’s free and easily consumable. 

Short actionable guide might be, you like what we do, maybe you want something more structured so here is a 30-day program, a 30-page PDF which has the beginners course and you charge, let’s say seven dollars. 

A small amount of money but it’s the first product that people buy and you start to generate a bit of cash. That’s great.

 The full information product might be a video course, it’s different videos to what are available on YouTube, but this is 30 hours’ worth of videos to guide you through a 30-day process of getting started in yoga and it costs $47.

Harms: If your theme is mastering moves it could be mastered the 30 most important yoga moves there are.

That will be the full information product someone can buy.

Kyle: Then the premium product would be now that you’ve built this reputation as this great yoga teacher, now you can actually tour the country or even the world and host sessions based on this and your charging.

I imagine quite a lot of money for people to attend the sessions and to learn from you. 

So at that point, yes, maybe you are using your time, but the revenue per hour is going to be huge because people trust you, they like you, they’ve purchased your products and that allows you to command a much higher price.

Harms: This is a classic example but that is now you’ve built a business and you’ve got a following and you’ve got a fan base, or how you want to describe that community that will want to purchase your premium product. 

That can be whatever you’d like it to be. 

It could be individual access. It could be group access. 

It could be online only, you could do what Kyle did within one of his businesses, which was to say there is no premium product here because I don’t want to exchange my time within this category. 

I’ve built an online business that creates a passive income and remember the warnings we’ve associated with that because he’s done the work up front, it now has become passive. 

So that part is whatever it is to you.

If you were to take one thing away it would be what is my expert business that I would like to create online that I’m going to do the work for, that I’m going to have the passion in and the enjoyment and the love for this excellent business I would love to build online? 

That’s the focus.

Kyle: The question is what can I help people with? 

What problems can I help? 

That whole chart you’ve just seen you are basically answering the same problem but with different levels of detail along the way. 

The problem might be I want to maintain flexibility and I want to learn yoga, how do I learn yoga? 

The free videos are a way to start off, the low-cost guide about mastering the downward dog is a way to expand on that moving up into a full video course you pay for, and even if you really want to go for it the live sessions.

Harms: I think if you have that joint combination which is number one, is helping it has to come from that place first, which is helping answer someone’s problem and then the other intersection is what do you actually enjoy doing, like doing, have a skill set and expertise in now you’ve got that common thing which is somebody who wants to pursue their passion. 

What they love in life. I think that’s getting closer now to that place, rather than just creating products for the sake of it, which yes will make you money, but it’s just creating and answering someone’s problem where you may not generally be the expert in here.

Because there are lots of people out there who are very good at repurposing information and selling it as if they are the expert. We’re staying away from that area as well.

Kyle: If you are going to repurpose information make sure you add something to it, you need to make it easier to consume. 

You need to teach it in a better way because, let’s be honest, the information is out there. Information is very easy to find, so any individual or any company who thinks they have this secret information that they can’t tell people, the information is there if somebody really wants to find that information they can piece it together from YouTube and books.

What you are offering is not just information but a way for people to make their way through the information. 

This is a common mistake as well, whenever we talk about digital products like this putting your expertise into a product people are like, I need to write a book and then they rush off and they write this 300 page ebook which they then give people in exchange for an email address on the websites.

Imagine I’m on my phone and I found this thing I’m interested in learning about, so I signed up and got this free ebook. I now have a 300-page ebook on my telephone, am I going to read that? 

Am I going to move forward? 

Am I going to progress with learning about this skill from this expert?


It’s too overwhelming.

You start small, still delivering huge amounts of value, but it needs to be consumable and then you work up to something like an e-book. 

If you are thinking about rushing off and drafting up an e-book we are going to show you how you ease people in, which also means that this is great for you. 

You don’t need to go and spend six months writing a book, you can start with much easier to produce much faster to produce pieces of value first and then we escalate further.

Harms: If you approached Kyle and I and we both presented you with the same topic that we’re talking about now, but the first interaction we had together was I gave you a 300-page ebook, and I said you’re going to learn everything you need in this 300-page ebook. 

It is free. I just want your email address. Whereas Kyle says I’m not going to give you a 300-page ebook what I’m going to do is spend an hour with you on YouTube and just talk to you about some of the starting points of creating an online expert business and info business that you can create and make money from in the future. 

Who would you select?

My gut feeling would be Kyle. 

Because I need to go on this path of discovery to see if it’s for me.

If the people you’re actually selling your product to actually get to this point, after going through this process whatever you’re teaching them, one of the best feedback mechanisms for your teaching is if they actually do it. 

They implement it and they’re super pleased with their output and even the ultimate mechanism is they go and surpass your teaching and go and do something even better, or even different to what you are doing. 

That’s the whole spread of art and culture which is amazing. 

That’s where we want to get people to rather than just hitting them and overwhelming them.

What you have learned so far:

  • Create an onlines business by leveraging your expert skill
  • What is an infopreneur
  • How to create a passive income online
  • Understand an online info businesses value ladder



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